Ask the Collective
The questions independent drinks founders ask most — answered. Distilled from years of community knowledge so the good stuff never disappears in the feed again.
How do wax seals perform on bottles from environmental and production perspectives?
Wax seals add artisanal appeal but present significant production challenges unless scaled cost-effectively. Environmental credentials are unclear and warrant direct customer validation. **Production considerations:** - Hand-dipping is labour-intensive but feasible at smaller scales; **Maker's Mark** demonstrates the approach works at volume with viral-worthy hand-dipping production footage - Automation exists but requires investment to justify cost-effectively - Staff can find the work satisfying (one member's 81-year-old production manager considers it their favourite part of production), but it's time-consuming - Members warned the work "is not too bad" but "hard work" — only worthwhile if the premium justifies the labour cost **Branding and market risks:** - **Sipsmith** ditched wax seals in a recent bottle redesign (reported in just-drinks); research their reasoning before committing - Red wax risks trademark issues if it closely resembles **Maker's Mark**'s signature dipped bottle - Shelf appearance and consumer perception vary; one member advises testing mockups with your ideal customers before committing **Commercial opportunities:** - Members suggest offering distillery tour experiences where customers hand-dip their own bottles as a premium add-on revenue stream **Environmental angle:** The excerpts do not contain substantive discussion of wax seals' environmental impact. If sustainability is your primary driver, validate claims and customer perception before investing in the process.
What are the pros and cons of cellulose-based plant-based capsule closures for bottle sealing, and what are the regulatory and retail listing implications?
Cellulose-based plant closures are a plastic-free, compostable sealing option, but they come with handling challenges and significant retail compliance risks. **Suppliers and product specifics:** - **Viscose** — the main UK supplier mentioned. They produce cellulose capsules made from wood pulp fibres that are plastic-free and compostable (decompose in soil within four months). They're supplied "moist" in bulk containers (described as "commercial-sized baked bean tins"). Several members have trialled these successfully. **How they work:** - Shrink naturally at room temperature as they dry, or you can use a heater to speed up the process - Require careful handling — "not the easiest to handle" but deliver good results when managed properly **Critical retail compliance issue:** - **Major Tesco red-list problem:** These capsules are on Tesco's packaging red list (their exclusion list for suppliers wanting listings). Tesco flags them as a contamination risk to recycling waste streams because they are neither traditional plastic nor certified compostable in their systems. This is a significant barrier if Tesco listing is a business goal. - Members who discovered PLA versions were also red-listed moved to rPET alternatives from Viscose instead **Key takeaway:** Cellulose closures work well operationally but check Tesco's current packaging requirements (2024) before committing if retail distribution is planned.
What is the B Corp certification process and timeline for drinks companies?
B Corp certification takes significant time to complete. The process typically takes **over a year**, with no way to speed it up despite B Corp working on shortening timelines and changing the whole process this year. Key requirements and tips from members: - **Written documentation** — have comprehensive written documents for everything, as this helps with validation during the accreditation process - **Score proximity matters** — if your current impact score is close to 80, certification may be challenging, as you'll likely lose a few points during the accrediting process and may fall short of the threshold - **No expedited contacts** — members confirmed there are no insider contacts or ways to speed things along Members recommend starting preparation early and being thorough with documentation, as the validation process is thorough and lengthy.
What percentage of post-consumer recycled content is typically in glass, card, and aluminium caps for drinks packaging?
Members have shared these typical recycled content percentages from their suppliers: - **Glass (standard flint)** — approximately 48% post-consumer recycled content. Your glass supplier should be able to provide the specific recycled content spec for your particular bottle if you ask (members note: you may need to ask more than once). - **Card** — approximately 80% recycled content according to member suppliers. - **Aluminium caps** — on average 50% recycled material. Members recommend requesting a sustainability report and detailed specifications directly from your supplier, as recycled content can vary by bottle type and production run. Allied Glass publishes sustainability reports that may help with benchmarking.
What sustainable branded merchandise platforms do drinks industry founders recommend?
Members have identified two key platforms for sustainable branded apparel that avoid overproduction waste. - **Teemill** — Print-on-order model means stock is only made when ordered, preventing excess inventory ending up in landfill. Members praise the quality and durability of both fabric and print. The platform uses 100% recycled cotton and plants trees with orders. Easy to set up, and members have successfully integrated it into their brand presence (example shop: avallen.teemill.com). Fabric feels high-quality on the skin. - **Brand Stamp** — Described as sustainable with high-quality output and low minimum order quantities, making it accessible for smaller brands. Both platforms appeal to founders wanting to avoid the traditional merchandise model of bulk production and excess stock. The on-demand approach is particularly valued for its environmental credentials.
How should drinks brands approach sustainability as a strategic business consideration?
Sustainability is increasingly table-stakes rather than a competitive advantage in the drinks industry. Members report it's now a baseline customer expectation rather than a selling point, and most established brands have made it central to their business strategy. Key approaches members are taking: - **Integrate into core strategy** — Make sustainability central to future decision-making and new product development (NPD) from the outset, not as an afterthought. - **Avoid greenwash** — Members emphasize it must be genuinely important (personally and professionally) rather than superficial messaging; authenticity matters. - **Treat as table-stakes** — The consensus is "everyone is doing it these days," meaning sustainability is now an expectation rather than a differentiation tactic. Caveats: The community discussion suggests this is a live, evolving conversation. Members are actively discussing how to implement sustainability meaningfully rather than how to use it as a marketing angle, indicating the landscape is still maturing.
How do paper bottle filling processes work and what are the key challenges and suppliers involved?
Paper bottles (such as Frugal bottles) can be filled on conventional bottling lines, but the process presents significant logistical challenges that most producers cannot handle in-house without specialist support. **Key supplier and process details:** - **Frugal** — Provides printing, assembly, and pouches in the UK. Their bottles come with full 360° label coverage. MOQ is 5,000 units (much cheaper and easier at 20k+). Material cost is approximately £1 per bottle, plus roughly £1 per bottle for filling. - **Silent Pool** — Experienced bottler offering filling services for paper bottles; members recommend contacting them directly for filling pricing and general information. **Critical challenges members highlighted:** - Filling is "a nightmare" and "FILLING hell" — most producers lack the right equipment due to pouch vacuum requirements and the need to weight bottles accurately. - **Do not attempt to fill yourself.** Members reported losing 6 months to failed in-house attempts. - Long lead times and frequent delays are normal. - Frugal's business model focuses on selling assembly machines rather than finished goods, which complicates access to bottling capacity and has driven up pricing. - Frugal is actively working to onboard more bottlers, but capacity remains constrained. **Retail and trade reception:** - No pushback from buyers or consumers; retailers and on-trade actually respond well once the sustainability story is explained. Some resistance to the plastic bag and cap, but sustainability is not a zero-sum equation. - Best practice: paper bottles for off-trade and e-commerce (low carbon, low breakage risk); bulk solutions or ecoSpirits alternatives for on-trade.
What shrinkage rates and return rates should we expect from reusable cups at events, and does branding affect how many cups get lost or kept?
One Planet One Chance is the recommended supplier for reusable event cups. Members who used them found that **unbranded cups performed better in terms of return rates** compared to branded versions, suggesting that strong branding may actually increase shrinkage as attendees are more likely to keep them as merchandise. The community operates deposit return schemes on reusable cups at events, though specific shrinkage percentages weren't quantified in discussions. Members noted that cup design quality affects theft/loss rates ("how shit hot your design is"), implying premium design increases keepsakes but reduces returns.
What are the best approaches for implementing reverse logistics to collect bottles and packaging back from consumers sustainably?
Reverse logistics for bottle collection is challenging but achievable through local, direct-to-consumer schemes. Members emphasise that reuse is significantly better than recycling for glass. **Practical approaches members are using:** - **Local bottle return schemes** — Several members are running local collection programmes with distributors and direct-to-consumer channels. One member reported collecting 60 bottles in a single day (their highest daily total), though typical weekly volumes are lower. These schemes operate on a smaller, hyperlocal basis rather than national scale. - **Direct relationships with smaller distributors** — Larger distributors typically won't engage in reverse logistics due to operational constraints, but smaller, more flexible distributors have proven willing to participate in return schemes. - **D2C (direct-to-consumer) collection** — Members are launching dedicated reverse logistics for direct sales channels, which offer more control over the collection process than traditional retail. **Key insight:** Members note that most mainstream distributors find forward logistics challenging enough and won't entertain reverse pickup. The feasible approach is building your own local schemes rather than relying on existing distribution networks. **Caveats:** This is early-stage work for most practitioners. The volumes are modest and consistency varies. Reuse-focused schemes require higher operational involvement than pure recycling but deliver substantially better environmental outcomes.
What disposal or reuse options are available for spent brewing materials like juniper and grains when local anaerobic digestion plants refuse to accept them?
When standard anaerobic digestion routes close—as happened recently when two major local AD plants refused intake—members have identified several alternatives: - **Animal feed** — Spent grains and similar brewing waste can be diverted to animal feed suppliers or farms as a feedstock. - **Specialty fertiliser projects** — Members have contacts developing waste-to-fertiliser conversion projects; reach out locally to see if your spent materials qualify as input feedstock. - **Food ingredient repurposing** — Spent berries and similar materials may have applications as marinades or other food products rather than waste. **Caveat:** Traditional waste removal (e.g., tank cleaning via Biffa) is costly—one member reported a £3K charge for tank cleaning—so these reuse routes are preferable where feasible. The two major local anaerobic digesters have recently tightened intake due to increased household waste volumes, so backup plans are increasingly necessary.
What are cost-effective and eco-friendly premium tamper-proof seal options for drinks products?
Members trialling sustainable seal solutions report exploring cellulose-based alternatives. The main recommendation that emerged is: - **Viscose Closures** — Members have trialled cellulose seals from this supplier (viscoseclosures.com) with positive early results. Hand application is required, which works well for producers at lower volumes or those already making products by hand. Several members have switched to this option. Note: At higher production volumes, hand application may become impractical and alternative solutions would need exploring. The discussion did not cover cost comparisons or other eco-friendly seal alternatives in detail.
What consultancies or advisors do members recommend for navigating B Corp certification?
Members have recommended a small number of specialist consultancies for B Corp support. **Definitii** (contact: michelle@definitii.co) was recommended by a member who was in early conversations with them at the time of discussion. **Ecofye** (www.ecofye.com) was also mentioned as a resource. Members seeking support should expect to discuss availability and timelines directly with consultants, as turnaround can vary. One member flagged uncertainty about the regulatory landscape around B Corp certification going forward, suggesting it may be worth clarifying the long-term stability of the standard before committing significant resources.
What is the carbon footprint of different glass bottle weights, and how much does reusing bottles reduce emissions?
Glass production carries a measurable carbon cost. **1.25g CO2 per gram of glass** is a widely referenced benchmark, originating from a 2007–10 US study by GPI and supported by similar findings in Bogaard et al (2014), though the figure varies depending on recycled content and transport distances. Bottle weights vary significantly: spirits bottles typically range from 765g (lightweight) to 920g (Long Island standard), while wine bottles often sit below 500g. **Reuse is dramatically more effective than recycling.** Members report that glass reused 7–10 times is considered to have near-zero incremental CO2 impact, though this specific claim lacks readily available published sources. One member has been running a bottle return scheme since 2018 and reports collecting up to 1,000 bottles annually. **Practical reuse strategies:** - **Local collection loops** — the most viable approach; one member works with local retailers (who offer consumers money off for returns) and local pubs (bottles collected during regular visits to avoid extra journeys) - **Consumer incentives** — offering donations to charity for returned bottles, or discounts at point of purchase - **Avoid national logistics** — most distributors struggle to handle returns at scale, so schemes only work regionally **Key caveat:** Transport distance and recycled-content percentages materially affect the baseline CO2 figure for any given bottle, making site-specific calculations essential. The research in this area is under constant review and relatively dated.
How should spirits producers respond to Tesco's packaging material red/amber/green preference list that restricts PVC, PLA, complex laminates, and natural cork?
Tesco's packaging materials preferred list classifies PVC and PLA as red (avoid), complex laminates including aluminium as red, and natural cork as amber (minimise). This creates a significant challenge for spirits producers, as these materials dominate current tamper-proof sealing solutions. **Options members are considering:** - **PET heat shrink** — Listed on Tesco's green list as an alternative to PVC/PLA for seals; however, suppliers report substantially higher costs and higher minimum order quantities (MOQ) compared to current materials - **Paper top straps** — One of the few remaining tamper-proof seal options compliant with the red/amber restrictions - **Plastic stoppers** — The materials list effectively pushes producers away from natural cork (amber) toward plastic alternatives **Key context:** The materials list appears designed for a broad range of food and beverage categories rather than specifically optimised for spirits. Several producers have not yet changed their packaging to comply and are considering whether to approach their Tesco buyers to understand the rationale and flexibility behind the restrictions. No confirmed examples of producers having successfully negotiated exemptions or alternative arrangements were discussed.
What are the recommended 3PL providers that are bonded and have an environmental focus?
Members recommend a small number of proven 3PL partners that meet both bonded status and sustainability criteria. - **LAW Distribution** (Haydock) — described as very good and cost-effective; members can request contact details directly - **Diamond Logistics** — reported as reliable, uses Hexi Flex or pulp-based packaging materials for environmental focus Members emphasise asking directly for contact details when interested, as relationships are personal within the community.